Bill Johnson and Bethel Associate Pastor and Dean of BSSM Dann Farrelly discuss Bill’s belief that Jesus Christ is Perfect Theology.

i’ve got to explore what’s possible in

my lifetime i got to know i’ve got to


i’ve got to know what’s possible in my


by by following this one who became a


still god but became a man to set an

example that could be followed


we talk about this we have a phrase

jesus is perfect theology

um uh

william syre who is the editor of

christianity today he said the fabulous

quote he says jesus is the kind of god

god is

now you got to think about it i put it

on a t-shirt from my singles group it

didn’t work because

you had to look at the t-shirt too long

and it was inappropriate so i was like


some quotes speak to you not to


but that helped me understand that jesus

is perfect theology is jesus is the kind

of god you want to know what god cares

about what his priorities are yeah what

his when when he’s when he’s saying i

you know i don’t like sin but i’m not

going to prioritize judgment in this

moment you need to see with the woman

called adultery you need to see that who

god is in those moments so you want to

speak to this idea that

what do you mean when you’re saying

jesus is perfect theology

well he is the perfect manifestation of

the father because he’s god because he’s

eternally god absolutely let’s not mix

that up

no he never stopped being god never took

it very completely never set it aside no

eternally god but as

as god

in the flesh he illustrates the father

yeah i mean

it you know is there a greater mystery

of how jesus can be 100 god and 100 mad

fully god fully man i i don’t know i i

think the church has wrestled with that

one for 2000 years because it’s and we

end up basically saying if we overstate

it we might say heresy so we just kind

of don’t overstate it and yeah we just

hang out here

yeah i

yeah i don’t want to do that i don’t

i want to stay

anchored in the word

but i don’t want to stay anchored

against people’s fears or suspicions i

i’ve got to explore what’s possible in

my lifetime i got to know i’ve got to

know yeah i’ve got to know what’s

possible in my lifetime

by by following this one who became a


still god but became a man to set an

example that could be followed and he

illustrated the father perfectly jesus

said if you’ve seen me you’ve seen the

father so in other words he was saying

you know old testament i love the old

testament by the way i love the old


but the old testament did not reveal god

as the father

in the way that jesus did no i think

it’s only in there like there’s 16

verses or something in the whole old

testament yeah and it’s what what was

revealed there is powerful profound and

necessary absolutely but it set the

stage for the ultimate revelation

jesus came is my conviction

obviously jesus came to die

he came to

uh you know to destroy the works of the

devil yes

all of that

but he his

his primary purpose in coming i think

was to reveal the father

he came to reveal something that had

never been clearly seen before so when

you see

jesus with a woman caught in adultery

it’s a father-daughter moment

who of us as dads

would not do the same thing if our

daughter was in trouble we would stand

there with that daughter

against the opposition of the crowd

could care less what anybody thinks i’m

here for my girl i’m here for my group

and that’s what you see in that moment

you see jesus representing the father so

powerfully so purely so beautifully not

excusing sin not ignoring but still just

letting kindness

lead to repentance you know that’s the

standard and that’s that’s the father

jesus displayed the father

and that i feel is our responsibility

yeah we’ve got to to learn how to do the

same thing we’ve got to somehow find a

way to manifest what he’s like

yeah that’s that’s that’s that’s why we

followed this one who was perfect

theology absolutely yeah he was uh

absolutely jesus came to die for our

sins and conquered the power of death

but actually revealing that he is our

father and when that yahweh

is abba yeah

that’s revolutionary and that’s a

journey like i think all christians

they’ll be delighted if they’ll take if

they’ll take that journey

that the yahweh the old testament

doesn’t cease any of those things he is

in the old testament the creator the

perfect judge yes uh truth itself but


wonderful and wild louis would call him

the judge of the rightful judge of the

earth is actually dad

yeah that changes everything everything

everything papa god

romans 8 the whole abba father thing

yeah that’s it we teach on that that

twice paul had to say um abba pater so


it’s written in greek but he uses the

aramaic abba

this kind of term of endearment of for

god as father and and kind of says i got

to use abba even though i’m writing to

greek speaking people in greek

i can’t lose abba it it speaks

it has that daddy a certain the french

would say a certain genocide you know

you just kind of need the word and it

feels like that’s the way uh paul used

it i would say because that’s the way

the the church that he was birthed you

taught him to pray

that they taught him to pray

daddy father but you know not father

because we don’t quite mean what the

greek mind thinks about father you’ve

got to have this aramaic

this daddy component and they go


so that absolutely the primary

revelation of jesus and i think that’s

his revolutionary teaching when you when

you look at this thread i’ve seen

peaking out of the old testament yeah

i’m actually going to not stop talking

about it

i’m going to drive you crazy with my dad

my dad your dad you’re like

if you call a model one more time i’m

gonna kill you i mean in some ways they


they did it like your familiarity with

god yeah it’s revolting to us that

that’s true you know so

that was part of i think what the

resistance to his message is it’s like

you you’re not allowed to think of god


that familiarly wow she’s like yeah yeah

i am and so were you

wow that’s well


so is there anything else you want to

add about jesus being perfect theology

though as far as like uh maybe it’s

thinking about healing and how we think

about healing

yeah i i think

here’s my approach and i realize there’s

there’s great diversity and the peop

even the people that i that i run with

we have wonderful conversations but uh

my approach is that is that jesus

modeled what life could be like

for anyone who had no sin

and who was empowered by the holy spirit

no sin

and empowered by the holy spirit because

he he he became a man

now if he did all of his miracles as god

obviously i’m still impressed i’m not

offended i i’m there on the sidelines


but if i discover he did them

as the son of man

then i realized he has just set a


that not only can i follow i must i must

follow i i cannot stay where i am

i i may stink at it my entire life but i

don’t have the option the luxury

of lowering his commission to what i’m

good at yeah i i am compelled to pursue

this example that he provided for me and

that is a relationship with the father

through the holy spirit a relationship

with the father where he knew what he

was to do you know he said i only do

what i see my father do i only say what

i hear my father say so he models a

relationship with the father god papa


he models a relationship and in doing so

picks up mud puts it on the eye in doing


tells the woman in adultery sin no more

in doing so he does all these different

things revealing what he’s like

and if he does that and and i look at

him as as the ultimate example of

theology revealing the

father then i i owe him the rest of my

life to follow that example regardless

of how successful i am or unsuccessful

i don’t have the luxury of changing the

standard yeah we talk about this in the

great commission right to go

and teach them everything i’ve commanded

you exactly baptizing them and teaching

them everything i’ve commanded you so

when we

he commanded the the prayer for the sick

and the healing of the sick and the the

ongoing relationship of the lord and

prayer life that is actually

somewhat conversational and and then uh

in john as the father sent me i send you

again i think that’s partly the ministry

of reconciliation but in that ministry

of reconciliation sometimes the

prophetic word

uh you know it happens um

uh the

the miracle of healing happens and uh

you know sometimes

not being healed you know happens you’re

like what am i gonna do now god will i

follow you still so that we we in in

that moment we are still inviting people

to be reconciled to the lord just as he

did and signs and wonders and prophetic

words and are all ways of kind of

inviting people into that reconciliation

that he’s that he’s longing for yeah

exactly that’s right that’s right we

we owe the world

that example we we owe them our best

effort if i can reduce it to that we we

owe them our best attempt

at representing him well making sure

that when there’s breakthrough he gets

the credit yeah not us absolutely and

when it doesn’t work

i take the responsibility i i don’t i


accuse him i don’t accuse the people

i’ve ministered to it’s i’m going to

take it personally not in a position of

condemnation or guilt but you know what

every time i prayed for someone that was


it showed what god could do

every time they weren’t healed it

revealed what i can do okay

and so that’s the way you process the

unanswered prayer in that particular

moment rather than create a theology uh

based on

yeah sometimes we think like if the

lord’s in it it’ll go perfect i’m like

what have you read the bible

it’s not

like if healing’s really from god

everybody get healed like no no i mean

god’s really in my marriage but

it ain’t perfect you know it’s really in

my messages but

those messages aren’t perfect and

there’s this odd thing that we apply to

healing or prophecy that we don’t apply

anywhere else i mean god’s involved in

the world for his purposes to well put

in an angle and perfect


so i’m not sure why that standard has

been applied yeah you know to to healing


so when i’m reading the gospel of john

the whole time jesus doing miracles is a

kind of a an example if the kingdom has


they would draw attention they would

bring people to a point of decision yes

in that moment because even if you’re

healed it’s like did you go back and

thank him

the leper right so he’s like the miracle

wasn’t the thing it was the relationship

and so the miracle led to the the

gratitude leads to the connection and so

in our heart the miracle is not the

thing that it’s a it’s a tool

of revealing who god is and then

inviting reconciliation and connection

exactly is that

and so i i would agree with that i do

think in the way john wrote his gospel

that there he’s got those seven signs

that he highlights right when i look at

those miracles the way john wrote about

him sometimes i i think that he’s trying

to reveal i am messiah i am the anointed

one and i’m not sure the jewish mind

kind of knew that the anointed one was

actually the second person of the

trinity it kind of like we came to


the divinity of the messiah as christ

unfold and the disciples kind of were on

that journey too they’re they’re like

that the idea that good jewish boys

monotheists worship jesus while he’s


is mind-breaking at some level that they

were moved to worship a man whose mama

traveled with them or they knew

that’s an amazing journey that they’re

on when they move our move to worship


so but but in john i think that some of

those miracles are

they’re not just do the same miracles as

me but i am who

i am the messiah you’ve been looking for

would you agree with that that there’s a

revelation and especially in the way

john works on his miracles that reveal

the role of jesus and ultimately his

divinity yeah absolutely absolutely


at one point in john 10 i think it is he


you know if you don’t believe me believe

the miracles

he wasn’t saying the miracle is a

greater reality he was saying listen if

you’re struggling with me look at what

i’ve done because it’ll bring you back

to me and i’ll point you towards the


you understand the connection there it’s

like he would direct their attention it

almost sounds uh offensive in scripture

if you don’t believe me believe

believe the miracle but that’s what he

was saying he says look at what’s been


it will direct you back to me yes and i

will direct you to the father because

i’m only doing what i see the father do

and it’s the whole reconciliation thing

again he was always trying to connect


to the father that was it he was always

trying to bring reconciliation

absolutely yeah just think about john as

well you get that weird one where you

can have a man born


who is healed

and yet i think it’s john 9 there

they’re like no we’re not sure you’re

the guy the parent’s gonna go no no he’s

that guy


but we don’t want to get in trouble we

don’t get kicked out of synagogue so he

can speak for himself but if you don’t

want to see a miracle you won’t see a

miracle at some point

or you’ll attribute to the the devil

which is what they ultimately do yeah um

is saying that’s by the power of the

devil just this crazy moment of

of of resistance to a supernatural

experience of the lord yeah you see it

in john 12 when the father spoke and

part of the crowd said no that was

thunder another crowd said no that’s

angels talking to jesus it’s like it’s


one one group thought it was a natural

phenomenon yeah another thought it was

supernatural but it wasn’t for them yeah

it was for jesus yeah yeah and yet jesus

heard the father clearly

and as you read it further in the

chapter you see they were they were

predisposed towards unbelief they

already had that point of resistance in

them and it was the resistance i think

yeah it was the resistance in their

heart that translated the phenomenon

into a natural event or impersonal

supernatural moment and then john under

the inspiration of the spirit years

later is kind of saying i got to tell

you this story about a god encounter


in the moment was interpreted three

different ways yeah yeah exactly like so

sometimes we think oh no that er when

god moves everybody knows it like

no i it doesn’t work that way i wish it


it’d be super convenient yeah i wish i

wish it did it’s kind of the tender and

heart that i will go that’s the lord

yeah that’s the lord in that moment so

that’s we’re trying to cultivate that


you know just something as simple as

like i i have kind of a natural

disposition to not believing things

partly being connected to you i think i

was raised with doubt like doubt will

protect you dan you know you know and

i’m like i was raised in the church

where it’s supposed to be about faith

but somehow doubt became my baseline

protector of truth so it’s been a

journey to kind of like reach for faith

right before i reach for doubt

it because it was just so woven into my

christianity into my upbringing so i’m

trying to hear a miracle story and go

okay yes i’m having difficulty believing


but it’s a trustworthy person eyewitness

testimony you know i’m like i’m gonna

tell me more you know and then i’m

like in our environment like with

somebody say i’ve been healed of cancer

we’ll we’ll ask we’re like were you

under a doctor’s care and be like yes

and i’m like well

don’t leave that out of the story

because that that the intervention of

the lord in medicine through somebody

who gives their life to medicine or life

to cancer research like that’s beautiful

yeah i put that in the story too but but

the bigger story is just trying to reach

for faith instead of doubt as a

self-protection has been a journey i’ve

been on with you that i’m thankful for

because i think as a raised in western

education i was raised in the school of


and and

it’s just the way it works

i i’d be listening to guys in chapel i’m

19 right i’m in 1920 and i’m like you’re

right you’re wrong these are men or

women that have spent their whole life

on the mission field and i’m like 20

thinking nope wrong you’re not anointed

i don’t even know if i thought of people

being anointed more right or wrong at 20

i was either right or wrong in the

christianity i was raised in and so when

i think about like how oh just the

arrogance or that parsing up

christianity based on right or wrong

it was that

school of doubt that i was raised in and

uh it’s been a journey to kind of like

take the best of that

you know like if the emperor’s naked

somebody needs to go the dude has no

clothes on like there’s got to be some

people in the environment that’ll do


but but take the the good parts of that

because the lord’s given us our minds

but also to say no no i got to reach for

faith like the lord’s good he does good


his people he’s on the move

what is he up to and um and just to be

able to kind of go so that’s what i try

not to go unbelievable or like that’s

incredible which means unbelievable

right at some level so i’m like trying

to be a little bit more even in my first

words like bless the lord

because i’m here to because i’m hearing

miracle testimony